Maggie 00:00:00:

Doesn't have a place in my life anymore. I wish I could have sooner. Not just opened my mouth, but my heart. And laid on the ground and said, help me.

Dana - 00:00:22:

Welcome to Hustle and Gather, a podcast about inspiring the everyday entrepreneur to take the leap. I'm Dana.

Courtney - 00:00:27:

And I'm Courtney.

Dana - 00:00:28:

And we are two sisters who have started multiple businesses together. And yes, it is as messy as you think, because we know that starting a business isn't easy.

Courtney - 00:00:35:

I mean, we've done it four times. And on this show, we talk about the ups and downs of the hustle and the reward at the end of the journey.

Dana - 00:00:41:

And we love talking with our guests about important topics that we've seen in our entrepreneurial journey. We've covered things like team building and work-life balance so far.

Courtney - 00:00:49:

And now we are talking to some incredible guests on how they have recovered after tragedy. You know, when you simply can't separate life from business. We'll be talking about how to handle those unexpected moments and how to grow and move forward through these experiences.

Dana - 00:01:02:

So this week, we're continuing our conversation with Maggie Stewart all about her journey in business with self-worth and the power of telling your story, not always when things are perfectly buttoned up from the top of the mountain, but even when you're in the midst of scaling it.

Courtney - 00:01:13:

Let's get back to it.

Dana - 00:01:02:

So like back in Raleigh, you're moving and shaking, growing this business.

Courtney - 00:01:19:

You're married.

Dana - 00:01:20:

You're married. Yeah, all that's happening. And then like let's talk about how – because we kind of semi-found Maggie back back. Yes. Yeah. Well, we got Maggie back where she should be.

Maggie 00:01:31:

Yeah. Basically. I remember. So we rent this amazing duplex, two-story. We lucked out so hard. There's like two little bodies of water. We have our own personal dock. It is an oasis. It's incredible. And we signed the lease sight unseen. And I remember it was like October of 22. Because we moved back July of 22. It was October of 22 when we officially moved into a place on our own. We were ping-ponging back and forth between in-laws. Until then, which was very stressful. But we... We're sitting there in the living room and I felt like... This is so incredible. The other shoe has to drop soon. Like I was just waiting. Because even though I went through this like... Spiritual revival out in Colorado that summer. Like, think about it, guys. You're getting paid to get well in Denver, Colorado. You're making 80K to get well in Denver, Colorado.

Dana - 00:02:37:

I'm going to speak to my business partner about that. That is not what my recovery has looked like at all.

Maggie 00:02:33:

You're getting paid to go to Red Rocks. Your recovery doesn't look like that. You should talk to HR.

Dana - 00:02:46:

I am. She is HR.

Maggie 00:02:49:

Okay. You need to talk to yourself. But. It was this magical summer, but it was still like hard. It was hard work. And I'd been in survival mode since I arrived in Denver, Colorado that November of 2020. And I remember sitting there and I was like, relief. I'm home. I'm in this oasis of a house. I love, I do not deserve this. My business is going great. And I remember saying this to my husband, Hennessy, and he's like, don't put that out into the world. Like. Just soak it in. God wants you to just soak this in. I was like, I'm trying. I was right. The shoe dropped shortly after that. And I feel like that's how it always goes, right? Like you're... In this zone, things are going so well for you. And that is the moment where the humbling begins. So it started in October of 22. And I remember the first time I ever really noticed something was off is I was talking to my dad and I was like, dad, I feel like. I have nothing to say in conversations, which I don't dominate conversations. I'm a really good listener, but I didn't have anything insightful or intuitive. It was like my gut was off. I felt And that's the first thing I remember. The first time I ever talked about. Something is wrong. My dad is my sounding board for a lot of things. And I was like, something's. Weird. Like I don't have anything to add.

Dana - 00:04:19:

Mm-hmm.

Maggie 00:04:20:

Ha ha, like if I knew now what I knew then, like that was the beginning of just this insane, painful.

Dana - 00:04:28:

Mm-hmm.

Maggie 00:04:29:

Health journey. And before I dive into some more of the specifics, I want to stress, like, I'm not on the other side of this. I am still climbing that mountain. And I think it is so important, though, to talk about it when you're still on the mountain, while things are still fresh. And to talk about it with people that you know and love, like you guys.

Dana - 00:04:51:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:04:51:

And the rest of the world, apparently. Um... To talk about it because people can provide insight and see things in your life that you don't see. So I'm talking about this. While I'm still climbing. And so this is either going to come out as completely chaotic and I'm trauma dumping, or I'm hoping that there are some nuggets here for people to take. And I don't know if anyone is listening to this and has any ideas on what's going on with me, let me know, reach out. But it started off with just like gut stuff and-

Courtney - 00:05:29:

You couldn't eat anything.

Maggie 00:05:30:

I couldn't eat anything. It was like everything would make me bloat up like a balloon. So uncomfortable. I felt weak. I felt like physically weak. Like I couldn't do my yoga anymore. And Courtney -ey, you and I connect on this. We both are yogis. We love our yoga. It's as much for our mind as it is for our body. That's our sanity. And. I had around this time all these big plans to relaunch my business with a new name. A branding shoot. I was like new service offerings. I was going to transition away from VA work and do more contract. Typework. And so I was going to launch that in January, but my body is starting to feel kind of funny and things are... Declining very quickly. And I didn't know. What to do? I didn't know what was going on. It got to the point where I now know that I wasn't getting nutrients to my brain. I think I'd pushed my body so hard from 2020 onward. I'd been pushing and pushing and pushing and pushing my body. And my mind. That my body finally said, I'm done. Like, I can't do this anymore. And it stopped working. Like the normal bodily functions that you're supposed to have mind stopped. And that can happen.

Dana - 00:06:50:

Yeah. Like it just stops absorbing nutrients. It stopped processing how it should be processing food.

Maggie 00:06:55:

Yes, it goes, what are the bare necessities? I can't keep up with everything. What can I pare it down to? And apparently my body decided my brain was not that important. And, you know, I learned a lot from that. Like, take care of your body.

Dana - 00:07:09:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:07:10:

Like we push it. I think our society makes us feel like we have to push it. But, your body's number one. If you don't have your health, you have nothing. My grandpa always used to say health is wealth. And as a 10-year-old, I did not understand. But that has been like my motto this year, like health is wealth. Might be poor health as well health as well um but yeah my brain wasn't working And I remember January was this big. Month for me where I was going to launch everything. I did my branding shoot with the incredible and amazing and magical Jamie Vinson. And she got these images back to me. But that morning of my brand shoot, I called Amanda Honeycutt. And I was like, I'm in so much pain. I don't feel like myself. I was bloated. Like you could see it in my face. You could see it in my fingers. I didn't look like myself. I looked jaundiced and pale. I didn't feel confident or beautiful. And I'm supposed to be. Launching this brand. Confidently, right? Like, And I think it was probably similar to with you, Courtney -ey, where you're like. I'm just a buoy in the middle of the ocean. And who am I? And what happened to me? Like, why am I questioning myself? But I remember saying to Amanda, I don't want to do this. Like, I don't want to do this shoot. And she said, well, you don't have to. And I was like, yes, I do. And so I did.

Courtney - 00:08:38:

Why did you feel like you had to?

Maggie 00:08:40:

I think, ooh, good question.

Courtney - 00:08:42:

Is this the one like where you had like your grandmother's dress on?

Maggie 00:08:45:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:08:45:

It looked beautiful.

Maggie 00:08:46:

Thank you. They are. They're beautiful images. But when I look at them. It's a bittersweet thing, right? Like. Now I can look at them and I see a really tough woman.

Dana - 00:08:55:

Yeah, for sure.

Maggie 00:08:56:

And I have so much respect for her. But it also sometimes makes me want to cry because I don't look like myself. And to answer your question, I felt like I had to because when you're an entrepreneur. It's a little bit different for you too, I feel, because you have each other. For a lot of us solopreneurs, we are the only ones who can push things forward. We really needed money. I really wanted to do it for myself. And if I'm being honest, there was a little bit of ego too. Like I have always been able to do anything I put my mind to. I am the girl who got this executive assistant job as the least qualified person he probably interviewed. I can do anything I put my mind to. Guess what? I can't. Plot twist. I can't, but I did it. So yeah, those photos, although they are stunning. Humbly, they are stunning. They are painful for me on some level.

Dana - 00:09:51:

Well, it's like one of those things like, and I think it's, um, I, I, it's one of the things we talk a lot about entrepreneurship is kind of changing that mindset that, that we have to, that hustle and grind culture. And I know it's called hustle and gather, but, um, it's more the hustle and grind part of it. Like, I feel like there is this attitude that you have to, you, you have to go through something really hard or like, you can't allow yourself the moment to rest and say, you know what? Like this is, my body is telling me this is not the time to do this. And, but at the same time, I commend you because as a woman, I know you did what you need to do for your family. And I, we all did the same thing. We all were like, it doesn't, it didn't matter if I was like bleeding from like, you know, whatever, but if my family needed the money, like I was going to do what I needed to do. You know, like it's very much that like instinct that I think that we all have as women. But I always say like, there used to be this badge of honor that you would, we would play. Like, oh, like I had Henry and I had a wedding three weeks later and I'd be like, and I'm like, but that's bullshit.

Maggie 00:10:56:

Yeah, it is.

Dana - 00:10:56:

Like how, why am I proud of that? Like, that's awful. And like, when I think back on like my regret and my like, my trauma from like not knowing, like, like. I think I'm going to cry every time I talk about it.

Courtney - 00:11:08:

Yeah. I know.

Maggie 00:11:10:

Yeah.

Dana - 00:11:10:

Yeah. But not remembering Henry. When he was born. When he was born. Yeah. Sorry. Every time. Like, I can never get to that story, like, ever. And I don't know why. I mean, I've, like, dealt with it for, like, years.

Maggie 00:11:26:

Have you dealt with it?

Dana - 00:11:28:

I don't know. I feel like I have. Yeah. I've been in therapy for many years.

Maggie 00:11:32:

Yeah. It's a very painful thing because you know you can never get that back.

Courtney - 00:11:36:

You can never get it back.

Maggie 00:11:30:

Yeah. People always cry with me.

Dana - 00:11:42:

Oh, okay. So it's you. So it's you, Maggie. Thank you. Thank you.

Maggie 00:11:45:

I made many mother of a bride cry.

Dana - 00:11:47:

Yeah. It is true. Yeah. But I mean, it's definitely one of those things like where, but like for so long, I was so proud of it because didn't that make me, didn't that make me the best entrepreneur? Didn't that make me like the best boss?

Courtney - 00:11:59:

Yeah. But I think it's like, yes, but it's unlearning all of those things that we were taught. Like that motherhood is all about sacrifice or that being an entrepreneur is all about sacrifice or the fact that you have to silo the two. Like you can't be a great mom and a great entrepreneur. Like you got to keep that mom life out of your, out of your work life. I remember, I think it was shortly after Mason. I was pumping. Like, I was, like, very newly mom, and I was pumping at a wedding, and I was at...

Maggie 00:12:28:

Sipes Farm. Yeah.

Courtney - 00:12:29:

Sipes Farm.

Dana - 00:12:29:

Yep.

Courtney - 00:12:29:

And I remember the bride got ready in, like, this little shed thing that was, like, off the barn or whatnot. And I had to step away and pump and whatnot. And I made sure I was, like, at a good time and, like, everyone was doing their thing. And I'm, like, sitting there in the— in the bridal suite, like pumping or whatnot. And there was no, there's just one big room. So like the bride walked in at that point and she needed something. She needed to be bustled. And I was like, oh my God, like, I'm so sorry. Like I wasn't there. And she was like, you, what? Have your baby, like pump in. Like you do this. Like you're such a badass. Like, don't worry about me. Like I'm fine. But I remember at the time I was like, oh my God, I'm falling down on the job because I have to like, I was literally about to explode, you know? I'm like, I had to do this mom thing and I just wanted it so siloed. Like, oh, I'm a hundred percent there for you. But I remember at the time I was like, oh my God, I'm falling down on the job because I have to like, I was literally about to explode, you know? I'm like, I had to do this mom thing and I just wanted it so siloed. Like, oh, I'm a hundred percent there for you. Like, I'm really not a mom. Like my kid doesn't need me. Like I'm not lactating at this point, you know? Like I can go eight hours and not do it. And like, we were opening the... It wasn't a bad point. Yeah. But it was like, but I remember feeling at the time like, okay, yeah. Maybe like everyone doesn't see it like that. Like I can be, this can be part of my brand. Like I can be mom and I can be entrepreneur and I can be all those things or whatnot. But I think that like for us, like we were very much taught that, that it was like, there was like business Courtney -ey and Dana and then there was mom Courtney -ey and Dana and the two should not interact.

Maggie 00:13:43:

And you guys come from entrepreneurs.Like your father, right?

Courtney - 00:13:46:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:13:46:

So I think, you know, even more so for you guys, it's ingrained in you. In everyone's defense here, I think that... It's hard as an entrepreneur to truly embrace the season you're in. Because a lot of times we become entrepreneurs because we said, we're not accepting this. The same thing that makes us successful at what we do and what we do is what holds us prisoner to it. Like, wishing away the season that we're actually in that is so common for entrepreneurs. And that can involve a number of things, like personal life and professionally. Like, what season are you actually in? And why do we wish it away? But I can see how. Like I said, I'm an entrepreneur because I said, this isn't working for me.

Courtney - 00:14:35:

Right.

Maggie 00:14:36:

I'm going to will something to happen.

Dana - 00:14:38:

Right.

Maggie 00:14:38:

I'm going to figure it out. And I think we channel that same energy into these seasons that we don't want to be true.

Dana - 00:14:46:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:14:47:

And I so wish, looking back, that I sooner would have said, this is a season of rest. And that doesn't mean that I'm not going to launch this business. That does not mean that I'm not going to have a beautiful brand shoot. It just means that for some reason, the answer is not yes, it's not no, it's wait.

Dana - 00:15:07:

Right.

Courtney - 00:15:07:

Yeah.

Dana - 00:15:08:

Yeah. It's for sure. But it's so, that's like, that is the hardest thing. It's the hardest thing when you are a driven person.

Maggie 00:15:17:

Yeah. And that's why we're all here.

Dana - 00:15:19:

I'm the worst waiting waiter ever.

Courtney - 00:15:21:

Yes. That is 100% the truth.

Maggie 00:15:23:

But it's like the strength and the weakness, right?

Courtney - 00:15:24:

She's like, well, I was in this den yesterday.

Dana - 00:15:25:

And I'm like, uh. Well, it's not even that. But it's like, but it's like, I love you guys. But even when like, we know that there's something coming down the pipeline, like there's a new idea, there's a new, like something we need to change. I cannot rest. I literally cannot rest. I won't sleep until I figured it out. I've made a flow chart about it. Like I've like done whatever I need to do. Because to me, like there's this, there's just that anxiety of like making sure everything is perfect. Everything is right. And I don't know. It's, I think, and I think for people who are super driven, it's really hard to wait and know, like, is this the right time? Like even, you know, there's all these things coming out of the pipeline and I'm like, we should deal with this tomorrow. Let's handle it tomorrow. She's like, we can't deal with it tomorrow. Like there's other things to do.

Courtney - 00:16:12:

We're not in that season, Dana.

Dana - 00:16:14:

It's not what the time is, you know? It's not the season. So I totally. I understand that. It's hard. But it's really hard. And it's hard to have that, like be attuned to that, I guess.

Maggie 00:16:22:

Yes, it is. And then for me too, you know, I was still a pretty fresh new business. And I had gotten a lot of momentum around that time. And, um. There was no one else who could carry the business forward but me. And what does it mean if I don't? I put this out here. There's people who believe in me, who are rooting for me. What happens if I scale this back where I put this on pies? What I now know is I. Literally was not getting nutrients to my brain. So I couldn't have given anything. I kept one client on. During that period, which was months, months longer than I thought it would be. And I gave that client everything I had. And there were opportunities that came that didn't work out. Not necessarily because of me, but I understand why. Someone was looking out for me. Like someone was looking out for me. Like I wouldn't have been able to give that person my best. And isn't that what I want?

Dana - 00:17:20:

Well, honestly, that's even worse. Like it's worse to be able to say, hey, I'm going to do this and then not deliver.

Maggie 00:17:25:

Yeah, it's worse.

Dana - 00:17:26:

Than it is to be like, hey, like I just can't do it. Yeah, for sure. I mean, I definitely think that that's. A tough lesson to learn, but like super essential to having successful businesses.

Maggie 00:17:37:

And relying on the people around you.

Dana - 00:17:40:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:17:40:

I'm an emotionally analytical person. I said this at the very beginning, meaning I analyze my emotions and I have seen that as me being vulnerable. What I have learned through therapy, mind you, I did not come up with this on my own, is that's how my dad is. That's how I am. That's how I survived my childhood. It had its purpose. That's how I survived a really tough season when I was out in Denver. But it doesn't have a place in my life anymore. I wish I could have sooner. Not just opened my mouth, but my heart and laid on the ground and said, help me because I have this incredible community of people to rely on. That is a gift. That is such a gift. Not everyone had that and I didn't use that.

Dana - 00:18:27:

Yeah. It's really interesting that you say that because I've been, I'm actually extremely similar that talking to therapists, whatever.

Maggie 00:18:37:

Yeah.

Dana - 00:18:37:

They're like, you can sit here and you can say exactly how you're feeling and you can justify why you're, why you feel this way. You can talk very clearly about it. You can be, okay, you know what? I need to take a moment and think about it. And then like, you know, say, I don't know how I should feel about this. You're going to debrief with people, whatever. And in your mind, you've come up with why you feel this way. You come up with the emotion, you come up with a reason, but you never actually feel it.

Maggie 00:18:59:

Yes. I feel like you and I have always connected over that because we are similar in that way. But. It's like, I think for me, I won't speak for you. I'm curious if it's the same reason though. My childhood was messy.

Dana - 00:19:10:

Mm.

Maggie 00:19:11:

I fear a mess. I fear an emotional mess. And that's why I put my feelings into compartments. But what if I just let myself cry?

Dana - 00:19:21:

Oh, I know. But there's a point where you have to.

Maggie 00:19:25:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:19:25:

Like for, I mean, I'm very similar. Like I don't experience my emotions in my head at all. It's my body that's like, uh, we're going to do this.

Maggie 00:19:32:

Watch out. You're watch out.

Courtney - 00:19:34:

It's going to happen. It's going to happen all day. And you're like, uh, this is a day that apparently I'm just going to cry all day and not have any sadness. Yeah. It's the great sadness. I'm going to need some tequila and some curry. And we're going to have to like power our way through this because obviously my body needs to process this.

Maggie 00:19:47:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:19:48:

And it's like, but like even getting back to like the health situation, like that was one of the biggest things for me. Like that kind of was one of the final pushes towards like, I got to get out of this relationship because you're literally killing me. It's like my enzyme, like my blood work was coming back terrible. Like my liver enzymes are like off the charts. My cholesterol was super high. Like I was like, and they couldn't really point it to anything. And they're like, but stress could do this to you. And I was like, I'm that stressed that my body is like not working properly. And like, sure enough. Like five or six months after separating, like everything's back to normal. And I was like, oh yeah. So you were killing me. So like, I knew that, but like now I feel like. There's confirmation that happened. Yeah. Well, I mean, I think to answer your question, I don't think it's because my childhood was chaotic. I mean, there was definitely some uneasiness about it, but really what it was, was I was actually an extremely, extremely emotional kid. Like I felt my emotions all over the place and I allowed myself to feel emotional. I was happy. I was sad. I was angry. I was all the things. And then there came a point when that was not, it just wasn't okay. And so I was told like my entire life, I remember like I was told I was moody and I was too emotional. And Sam, when I met him, I would always like, again, self-deprecating say, and he's like, you're like the least like emotional person I've ever met in my life. Like in his mind, that was not actually the case. And so I learned that my emotions weren't valid. So therefore I had to process them in my head and I had to say, is this real? Is this true? Can I actually be sad about this? Or am I just being irrational? Right? Or can I be happy about this? Or is this just, you know, not something that is actually joyful, right? Or something that shouldn't be celebrated because like, it's not a big deal. Right. And so, and I don't allow myself to feel it in a lot of ways because of that. So it's one of those things like trying to relearn it. And I still, I'll never not process through my head. Like I just won't. It is a learned behavior for sure. Right. And the people who know me the best are the people who experience the emotion because it's the safest place I can have it. But if you don't know me well, like you'll never see me cry.

Maggie 00:22:04:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:22:05:

You'll never see me cry.

Maggie 00:22:06:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:22:06:

Like you won't see me break down. You won't see me be upset. You'll see me get like teary eyed or like a little bit emotional, but you'll never see me have a breakdown like and be sad about something. Yeah. You know?

Maggie 00:22:17:

It's hard and it's scary. And like, You hear... Feelings aren't fact.

Courtney - 00:22:22:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:22:22:

And I think that's used as an argument a lot of times when you're debating something with someone and they're talking about their feelings and you're like, oh, well, feelings aren't fact.

Courtney - 00:22:30:

Right.

Maggie 00:22:31:

So you hear that in your head, but feelings aren't fact, which also validates that we can have feelings.

Courtney - 00:22:36:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:22:37:

That don't have to be factual. They don't have to make sense. They don't have to, like, they're our own. And I say this because I'm the same as you, but why is it so hard? I think it's because we're trained a certain way. It's going to take years for me to undo what has been done.

Dana - 00:22:54:

For sure.

Courtney - 00:22:55:

Yeah, and I mean, I think obviously we grew up in like the same household. But as far as like emotions go, it was very, very different. Because it was like as the oldest in a household that. Like, I wouldn't even say that we were, like, there wasn't any, like, emotional training. There wasn't, like, any real emotional depth. Like, you just powered through, right? And you did what was best for the team, which was the family, like, regardless of how you felt about it.

Maggie 00:23:18:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:23:19:

Right? So, like, as the oldest and our mother, and I've said this before on the podcast, like, was in and out of the hospital. So, like, a lot of the responsibility fell on me for, like, watching Dana, watching Jeremy, making sure everybody ate, all those things. And our dad worked. Like, he went and worked. Hours and hours and hours. And mom was in the hospital or sick or whatever. So it was like, regardless of what you needed or wanted, it didn't matter because it wasn't a priority. So then for me, like emotionally, it was like, I never expressed them because. What did it matter? Like, even when I said, I remember very emphatically at, I think I was 12, and I was like. I don't want to watch these kids anymore this summer. Like, I want to go and I want to be a kid. Like, I don't want to have responsibility. My parents saying, that's not an option. Sorry. Like, we can't afford to hire anybody. It's going to have to be you. So, like, even when you got to the point where you were like, like, this is too much for me at 12 or whatever, it didn't matter. So, then it was like, it set me up very perfectly for, like, the relationship that I had with Mikhail where it was like, hey, like, you can pile all your emotional shit on me, all of your needs, because my emotions don't matter. And I still had the ability to, like. Put that aside and power through with whatever my duty was. And in a lot of ways, that helped me. Like, it helped me in a lot of ways because I don't ever feel like the negative emotions. I don't ever feel the fear. I don't ever feel like, wow, this could really go badly. Because I was like, it's probably going to work out. We're just going to keep putting one foot in front of the other and what happens, happens, and not really have like an emotional evaluation about it.

Dana - 00:24:46:

It's definitely like a, I don't want to say positive, but like a side effect of doing well in entrepreneurship because there's times when like you can feel all the feels, but like it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. It's not going to change what I'm going to do next. You still have to do it. You still have to do it.

Maggie 00:25:01:

Well, you were trained very well.

Courtney - 00:25:03:

Yeah, so I mean I was definitely trained very well, but like when that pertains to like, like I don't know, interactions and personal relationships, sometimes I think it's super crippling. Like, I'm like, how do I feel about that, Dana? How should I be feeling about that? Like, am I processing this the right way? Like, what's my blind side? Like, I don't understand, you know?

Maggie 00:25:19:

Yeah. I think it's interesting you say that you don't feel things, though, but your blood work showed differently.

Courtney - 00:25:24:

Oh, yeah.

Maggie 00:25:24:

So it's like your body. That's what's so insane. And I think people— forget that because we take for granted that our body is functioning. I no longer take that for granted. You no longer take that for granted.

Courtney - 00:25:34:

Well, there's three times in my life now, and it's like all happened in the last like four or five years that like I've literally lost memory of like what happened during the time.

Maggie 00:25:43:

It's almost like your body is trying to protect you.

Courtney - 00:25:45:

Yes.

Maggie 00:25:45:

It's learned.

Courtney - 00:25:46:

It's so wild, guys. Like big emotions are bad.

Maggie 00:25:49:

Yes.

Courtney - 00:25:49:

Like I'm protecting you.

Maggie 00:25:50:

And it's so, so weird. But it gets it confused because the body doesn't know the difference between good and bad necessarily. It just knows big.

Courtney - 00:25:57:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:25:58:

But yeah, it's like trying to protect you.

Courtney - 00:26:00:

But I'm just saying it's like I just think your body does take over when you're going through these big life moments. And it's like. Even unavoidable, even when I consider myself a semi non-emotional person, like it's unavoidable. Like at some point, like your body's going to take over and it's going to do what it's going to do.

Maggie 00:26:17:

Yeah. Your body is, you can be mentally unemotional, but your body is still emotional.

Courtney - 00:26:22:

Yes.

Maggie 00:26:22:

And like, I encourage people to pay attention to their bodies. Like if something doesn't feel normal, pay attention, go to the doctor, please take the time. Like when I look back, my symptoms started in 2020 and granted there were long periods where I didn't have insurance because I was starting my business and it was very complicated. But if you guys have insurance, go do the appointment, get the blood work done, see what's going on. Like, don't ignore that because health is wealth, baby.

Dana - 00:26:52:

So how have you begun to like, you're still in the middle of this, obviously still climbing the mountain. So how did you start to like overcome that physical journey?

Maggie 00:27:02:

I still don't know. Like step by step. There's still not been a doctor who's connected all the dots for me. My gut stuff is a lot better, but that's because I've learned to manage the symptoms. I'm eating a lot more. Like I was going, when I started my business, I wasn't eating a lot because I was stressed out. And there was a lot going on in my personal life. I'm eating more, you know, eat. Guys, eat. It's simple. You need to provide your body with nutrients. And so that has helped a lot. I've seen 10, 11 different doctors. They've helped with little things here and there. Like yoga is a big part of my life for my mental health and my physical health. I found that the mind-body connection is really strong and not to underestimate it. So I'm also going to therapy as well. I think that's important. But inch by inch and just slowly getting that gut feeling, that thing that I was born with, that intuition, fighting for that, it's back. I can form thoughts and sentences and provide insightful things for conversations now. And with that, I have confidence that I'll be able to intuitively know where to go for the answers that I need. And I'm going to fight for that. I'm not going to give up. I'm not going to say that I'm just going to live like this. I'm going to continue to fight and advocate for myself. So that's where I am now.

Dana - 00:28:26:

Yeah, that's awesome. I think that's all really great advice.

Maggie 00:28:29:

Yeah.

Dana - 00:28:30:

Well, we knew this conversation would run long because we do our conversations not run long.

Maggie 00:28:35:

It's us.

Courtney - 00:28:36:

It's us, for real. So we want to do like a little change up on our conversations with sisters. We're just kind of like continuing on here during this episode. And instead of us giving you kind of like, normally we listen, obviously, if you listen to our podcast. When we are finished with the podcast, we do our conversation with sisters. What's our favorite takeaway? What's our best business takeaway? What's our best personal takeaway? Maybe like a fuck up. We can maybe still share our fuck ups. I don't know. But I want to hear from your perspective because you're kind of like an honorary sister at this point. You've been with us through a lot of like our ups and down journeys. We've known you for, I guess, six years now. We did the math correctly. And I'm curious as to like kind of like knowing Dana and I and working with Dana and I, like what is your biggest takeaway?

Maggie 00:29:15:

From you guys?

Courtney - 00:29:16:

From us. What is your biggest like business? It can be either combined or separate. Best piece of business advice that we've given you or that you've taken from us and best piece of personal advice.

Maggie 00:29:28:

Business-wise. You guys taught me. That there is no formula. And I think if you go into entrepreneurship thinking there is a formula and you to do things a certain way. Godspeed, my friends.

Courtney - 00:29:48:

You will fail.

Maggie 00:29:49:

You taught me. To problem solve. It's okay to get creative with things. It's okay to do things that are non-traditional. It's okay to scrap an idea. It's okay to say that you're wrong. Like. You guys are very humble in that way. And I have so much respect for you because that's very difficult to to do in the position that you're in. As people. Dana.

Dana - 00:30:12:

China.

Maggie 00:30:15:

I feel like you've actually taught me a lot about vulnerability. Like I feel that some of the best conversations I've had about vulnerability are always with you. And you are one of the few people I've always felt like I can let all my walls down with. And that you actually understand. Because we are the same.

Dana - 00:30:31:

We're different. You're an Enneagram 8. I'm an Enneagram 2.

Maggie 00:30:33:

Let's not get it twisted. But. Yeah, you are one of those few people for me. And I think it's an honor to me because I know that it's hard for you to be vulnerable. When you are vulnerable with me, I'm like, wow, I feel so special.

Dana - 00:30:51:

Yeah, you should feel special.

Maggie 00:30:53:

And I do, and I do. And it's... Given me permission to be more vulnerable with people, especially you. Court, you and I connect on that. Confidence thing on the asshole level on the asshole level but we're not we're not assholes I think what I love about you and something you've taught me is just to have a good time. Like I have the most fun when I'm with you. It's always spontaneous, random. We can laugh at ourselves. We can definitely laugh at other people.

Courtney - 00:31:27:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:31:29:

And you bring this like really fun. Side to my life and just like business for your employees as well.

Courtney - 00:31:27:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:31:38:

Does that answer y'all's question?

Courtney - 00:31:41:

Yeah, I do feel like you can't take it too seriously. No. Like, I can't take myself seriously.

Maggie 00:31:45:

Right. And I think that's what I've learned from you.

Courtney - 00:31:47:

Yeah. Like, I... Bad, bad spot. Yeah. It all changes. You know what I mean? Yeah. That's how I feel about you.

Dana - 00:31:54:

It's so fluid.

Courtney - 00:31:55:

It's fluid, yeah. Where is this river taking me? I don't know. It's seasonal.

Dana - 00:32:00:

Yeah, it is.

Maggie 00:31:59:

It's seasonal. Like the world, we have seasons for a reason. And we in our lives are supposed to mimic those seasons. Maybe not like in winter you go hibernating for three months, but maybe. I would love to do that. Like why do we expect to always be in summer?

Dana - 00:32:15:

Mm-hmm.

Maggie 00:32:16:

We shouldn't.

Dana - 00:32:17:

Right.

Maggie 00:32:17:

Because not even the most magical thing, which is this earth, like, can do that.

Dana - 00:32:17:

Right.

Maggie 00:32:22:

It's not natural.

Dana - 00:32:23:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:32:23:

It ain't natural, folks.

Dana - 00:32:25:

Mm-hmm.

Courtney - 00:32:26:

I think that's true about Dana, too. Like, she always has had great, like, words for her feelings.

Maggie 00:32:31:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:32:31:

Like, her ability to, like, think and process.And I'm just like, oh. I just don't know how I feel about it. I just feel bad, whatever that means. I feel sad. It's all the words I have.

Dana - 00:32:44:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:32:44:

Who's got nothing.

Dana - 00:32:45:

Yeah. I don't know. I know. I have no idea where it comes from.

Courtney - 00:32:51:

Yeah, I know. Again, getting back to new relationships, like, and Taylor is, like, totally a cancer, so he's, like, all in his feelings. And he's like, you're doing so much better. You have, like, four words now to describe your feelings. I'm like, yeah, I know. Thank you. It's a big deal, actually. It's so difficult. Yeah. I know. I can only imagine how hard it is for you. I know. But Dana's always been that one that had like, you know, 37 words to describe how she's feeling at that moment, whether you want to hear them or not.

Maggie 00:33:15:

And what a gift, truly. Like, that's such a gift. I know, such a gift.

Dana - 00:33:20:

Is it?

Maggie 00:33:21:

Yes. For you. Absolutely. How cathartic.

Dana - 00:33:24:

No. Yeah. No, I don't know. I just, I mean, it's, it's, it's crazy. Cause you're probably similar. Like you, like when you've processed it in your head, you have to get it out. Like you just have to say the words and. Like even like now sometimes you're like, there's something you should just let lie. Like just let a lie. Like why does it matter? But you're like, no, no, I have to say it. I have to like say this feeling or this emotion. Like, and maybe that's how, maybe that's how I feel it or whatever. I don't really know.

Maggie 00:33:49:

We're like, check. Okay, onto the next. I didn't. We have not processed it at all.

Dana - 00:33:55:

Yes.

Maggie 00:33:56:

Oh, I love that.

Courtney - 00:33:57:

And I think one of the things that comes to mind when I'm talking to you in general is from Eat, Pray, Love and one of the favorite sayings from that movie, book, whatever. Is that when you're on a truth-seeking journey, every person you meet is a teacher.

Maggie 00:34:10:

Yes.

Courtney - 00:34:10:

And I think that. How very yogi of you.

Dana - 00:34:11:

I know. I know.

Courtney - 00:34:14:

But I think that. Like, I think, like, 2017 Maggie, 22, super cute, talking about her country, which, like, almost got her not, like, hired. Like her favorite music, but it's true. Yeah, we're like, I don't know about that. But anyway. Like, thinking about that person and, like, kind of, like, showing you the ropes of the business and then, like, going through, like, your, you know, complexity levels and, like, all of the things. And all the things you brought. And then kind of going full circle to, you know, you going to Denver and, like, coming back here. And even now when we've had, like, some questions about business or, like, whatever, we've called Maggie. Like, Maggie would have great insight into this, right? Like, we would love to hear Maggie's, like, opinion on this. And I just think, like, about this journey that is life and, like, how—and I do think, like, Dana and I do want to be the best business owners that we can be. And we want to be the best bosses. And we want to be the fairest. And we want to be the truest and whatnot. And whereas at the beginning of our journey, like, we were kind of teaching you.

Maggie 00:35:11:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:35:11:

As our journey continues, in a lot of ways, you're teaching us.

Dana - 00:35:14:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:35:14:

You know, like, am I teaching you guys?

Dana - 00:35:15:

Absolutely.

Courtney - 00:35:16:

Because that's, like, yes. If I am, I'm literally dying right here.

Dana - 00:35:19:

Yeah. Well, then this is the end. Rest in peace.

Courtney - 00:35:22:

I've peaked. You've peaked. But I just think that, like, you're on this life journey. And I was even telling Dana this earlier. Like, some people are seasonal and some people are lifers. And, like, for sure. Lifers. Just as you told us when you were going to be the fungus that you're a lifer that we can't get rid of.

Maggie 00:35:37:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:35:37:

And, like, as we continue this journey, I just love the truth that you bring into our life and the truth we're able to speak to each other. And I just love that. And I just think for people listening, you just never know. Like, they may be your employee one day. It, like, circles back and it's, like, look, like, preaching it to you when you're, like, you need to hear this.

Maggie 00:35:53:

Yeah. So. Yeah, I know. It's so true. Like when you view everyone as a teacher.

Courtney - 00:35:59:

It's true. Yeah.

Maggie 00:35:59:

It's incredible. Like. What can happen.

Courtney - 00:36:03:

Yeah, I agree.

Dana - 00:36:04:

It's that kind of like my favorite scene from Ted Lasso, the dart scene when he's like, just like stay curious, be curious.

Maggie 00:36:13:

To quote the great Ted Lasso.

Dana - 00:36:16:

But I loved it. I love it. I love it so much. And I say it to my kids even, like, all the time. Like, just be curious. Like, try new things. Like, it doesn't, you don't have to have all the answers. You don't have to have all the, you know, whatever. And, like, even as, like, we're, like, our family's transitioning into some things, like, with Sam and his job. And I say to Sam, like, just be curious. Like, you've never had the freedom to be curious. Like, you've never had the choice to, like, say, is this what I want to do? Is this where I want to be? I want to try this. Right? Because you've always been the financial backbone of everything. Right? And now you don't have to be.

Maggie 00:36:49:

Right.

Dana - 00:36:49:

And so, and he's like, I don't know how to do that. You know?

Maggie 00:36:52:

Be curious.

Dana - 00:36:54:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:36:54:

It's also, like. Don't be afraid to fail.

Dana - 00:36:54:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:36:59:

And failure does not mean you lose. Sometimes failure means you win. Like there are some clients I didn't book when I was at my worst. Why? Because I probably, it was hard for me to speak, right? I could have seen that as a failure. And at the time I kind of did, but it was actually a win because what would have happened if I had gotten them? I would have lost even bigger. Yeah. So it was a win. Sometimes failure is disguised.

Dana - 00:37:23:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:37:23:

It's true.

Dana - 00:37:24:

That is true.

Maggie 00:37:24:

Yeah.

Dana - 00:37:25:

You can think of lots of failures that became wins.

Maggie 00:37:27:

That's true.

Dana - 00:37:28:

Yeah. The most devastating thing that ever happened to us was not getting that business loan in the beginning. And it was the best thing that ever happened to us because we would have had two really shitty ballrooms.

Courtney - 00:37:35:

Two small subpar ballrooms. We didn't even have, like when we built that new ballroom, we didn't have to go through like planning, approval, anything. It was already like, oh yeah, you already got a second ballroom. Not that it was like three or four times the size of the original, but like, oh yeah, your septic's good. It's all good. Everything's good. And we're like, okay.

Maggie 00:37:52:

Yeah. That ballroom. Smooth sailing. Incredible.

Dana - 00:37:55:

Yeah.

Maggie 00:37:56:

So well-timed, guys. So well-timed. I know.

Dana - 00:38:00:

Yeah, but like all these things, you like, I don't know. I love that. I love thinking about that. And it's one of those, also the things that I love the most about entrepreneurship that I've learned how to change my mindset is that there's so many days you say, I have to do this. I have to get to my emails. I have to go to this meeting. I have to, have to, have to, have to, right?

Courtney - 00:38:19:

It's very few things you have to do.

Dana - 00:38:20:

And I've always, I've like started changing. It's like, hey, I get to do this. Like, and it bleeds into personal life too. Like there's like, we had a rough start to school year this year and like Henry's struggling right now. And it's been so, it's been so exhausting. Like just so exhausting. Like just trying to get him through and like, you know, trying to diagnose what's going on in his, you know, cute little brain and like, and doing all these things. And we're sitting there and they're like, we have, he's in tutoring. He's in tutoring three days a week. It's 4:30 to 5:30. And it's like, oh my gosh, you have to. And I'm like, you know what? No, I get to. And I get to pay for this really great tutor. Because I busted my ass for what, 20 years. Right. And I've created this life and this stability that when they're like, hey, this is what you need. You're like, okay, what, how much does it cost? Let me write you a check, pay it in full, take care of my kid. Like, you know, and it's just that. And when you, when you train, when you like train yourself to look at what could be really hard and overwhelming and what seems like a lot and you, and it seems like a, like a burden. It's like, no, like I, like I get to do this, you know, I get to do this beautiful and amazing life. And I think that's what has been the biggest change for me over the last year and a half.

Maggie 00:39:31:

For sure.

Dana - 00:39:31:

And going through like, cause I was diagnosed with depression and I've been on a, I've had a, I've been on medicine for a year and a half and it's been like a total life change.

Maggie 00:39:39:

Wow.

Dana - 00:39:39:

Like absolute life change. Because I. I mean, I'm definitely, you still go through it. Like you still feel things, but like. I can look at this life and say like, this is beautiful. This is a great life. Like I have a great life. It's not always easy, but it's amazing. And I wouldn't trade it for anything else or like in the entire world.

Maggie 00:40:00:

And without the depression, do you feel like you would have had that same perspective?

Dana - 00:40:03:

No, I don't. Because I don't think I would have known how dark it could actually be.

Maggie 00:40:07:

Right. Right. And see, so depression can seem like a failure.

Dana - 00:40:11:

Yes.

Maggie 00:40:11:

But actually, it's a win.

Dana - 00:40:12:

Because it does feel like a failure. It does. Why can't you pull your, like you guys are all talking about these terrible things happening and like what happened? Nothing. But I can't get myself out of the bed. You know what, though? We all have our different—

Maggie 00:40:27:

You were chosen to handle the life that you've been given. The trials that you were given were chosen just for you.

Dana - 00:40:33:

Yes. But it's definitely one of those things where you— If you can handle them, that's fine. I know. But you struggle with it. You're like, what a failure of a person.

Maggie 00:40:40:

Yeah.

Dana - 00:40:41:

There has been nothing that I should feel depressed about, but I do, and I did. But it's been my entire life. I mean, I look back on it, and everyone said, oh, you're so anxious. You're so anxious. And I never had anxiety. I actually don't have anxiety. I'm not anxious about things. I just was depressed. It wasn't anxiety. It was just depression. Just depression.

Courtney - 00:41:01:

Just a smidge, a little touch. Well, someone had to keep the wheel moving forward. There you go. You're literally just the engine. Just the engine. Yeah. Oh, guys. So good. Well, it's been great. I know. It's been great chatting. I know. It's been so awesome. I could do this. I could go on and on and on. I know. I could do this literally all day every day. Can this be a career for us?

Dana - 00:41:23:

Yeah.

Courtney - 00:41:24:

We'll just sit here and we'll be like the new, like, we can do hard things from Glennon Doyle, right? That's right. Yeah, let's do it. Yeah.

Maggie 00:41:31:

Well, I'm honored you guys asked me to be on this. Like, I really, in a serious way, I mean, I've peaked. Like, this is the greatest thing ever. I'm just so honored to be here.

Courtney - 00:41:42:

Thanks for being vulnerable and real.

Maggie 00:41:43:

Anytime. And I just love you guys.

Courtney - 00:41:45:

Love you.

Dana - 00:41:46:

Love you too. Excited to see where this all goes for you.

Courtney - 00:41:48:

Yeah. Me too.

Dana - 00:42:00:

To learn more about our hustles, visit us on the gram @canddevents, @thebradfordnc, and @anthem.house and @hustleandgather. And if you're interested in learning more about our speaking, training, or venue consulting, head to our website at hustleandgather.com.

Courtney - 00:42:12:

And if you love us and you love this show, we'd be more than honored if you left a rating and a review. This podcast is a production of Earfluence. I'm Courtney -ey.

Dana - 00:42:20:

And I'm Dana. And we'll talk to you next time on Hustle and Gather.